Ultima 8

[countzero]

I wondering if some guys here would be interesting to port the ultima 8 machine
also..

[wjp]

Yes, we are

http://pentagram.sf.net

[countzero]

I would like to take a cvs snapshot of the current version
(and all the beta files you got

[wjp]

Uh, is that a question or a statement?

Pentagram is open source, so feel free to take a CVS snapshot

[Karlos]

Is there anything that people like better about the U8 engine compared to the U7 engine? To me, the U7 engine seems superior in all respects. The U8 engine annoyed me so much that I never did get very far in U8.


-Karl

[countzero]

Karl i would really glad to see ultima 8 in my linux box ;-]
and *really* i don't care witch ultima is the best ;p

[Karlos]

I don't care which one is best, either (but I's say U&:BG), but I was wondering if there was something about U8 that other people liked that I missed since I gave up on it so quickly. To me, it lacked everything that made U7 parts 1 and II so great: no companions, no familiar turf to revisit, uninteresting NPCs and dialog, etc. Heck, even face portraits and the ability to choose a male or female avatar would have been a great addition.

Don't get me wrong; I still own U8 and I'd give it another try once Pentagram is playable, but I'm curious why there's more interest in it than I would have expected.


-Karl

[wjp]

The engine is quite elegantly designed (except for the absolutely dreadful savegame system). That's mainly why we're interested in rewriting it

[artaxerxes]

I used to think U8 was horrible and I refused to play more than 10 minutes of it.

Then after a few years, I decided to force myself to play from beginning to end.


I do not regret it. True, it is different but just stop comparing it to U7 and you'll see it's not too bad.

Artaxerxes

[Armchair_Avatar]

Does the U8 engine support multiple maps?

[wjp]

Lol. Yes

[Dominus]

(just to clarify the LOL: U8 consists not of one big map, but several smaller maps)

[wjp]

indeed

[Karlos]

Okay, multiple map support is definately an improvement. Anyone working on this feature for Exult? *grin*


-Karl

[Paulon]

What do people see in U8?
In my case it's got a unique and interesting world, IMO, with the bare bones of a good story. Unfortunately it lacks the flesh of the story to go with the bones, all the little details that made U7 and SI so interesting.

What I dislike the most was the jumping system, and the fact that the entire game seems to have been rushed. It had so much wasted potential that I suspect would have been made use of, IF they had finished U8 properly instead of rushing it out the door only half playable on the typical machine of the time.

[Morg]

U8 was a fun game, I liked the premis. I thought having the avatar on his own in a world that he isn't known would be fun.

I liked the idea of jumping, it added an additional amount of control and movement for the avatar.

That said. the way they forced jumping upon you as a nessessity, expecially as messed up as it originally was, was annoying.

[Dino3]

I agree... Ultima 8 had engine improvements such as jumping, but they FORCED you to jump... they made it an action game.

Still, the plot is quite interesting, even though it is the background of an action game.

I collect information for Ultima 8, so I'd like to see Pentagram working as an engine for Ultima 8 to make my work easier.

[Jiles]

I thought the music was one of the best parts of U8. Seriously. I don't mean that in a negative sense either. It just struck me as having really good music.

[artaxerxes]

check the mailing-list for the latest ideas about that

artaxerxes

[countzero]

Yeah it had great music and great atmosfere
and very good sound fx
(avatar stepping etc)

[lanzzz]

i like the u8 engine better than u7, too. but there are some nasty things that could have been polished (and i guess they would have been, if they didn't ship it half-ready) - one thing that completely pissed me off was fighting, especially with the floating red eyeball-thingies (whose name i really can't remember): when someone hits the avatar he groans wimpily, and then backsteps two VERY slow steps, during which he is uncontrollable. which gave MORE than enough time to the eyeballs to advance after the avatar and hit him again, before control is restored. two more steps back. well that really goes on until the avatar is dead, obviously. and note that the eyeballs don't suffer from the same back-stepping condition - they can quite easily attack you while you're hitting them! i can live with monsters that can fight back while being hit, but playing a wimpy avatar that goes into uncontrollable shock when hit was no fun. and that slow-motion can be seen all through the game - for example the guard that stops the avatar before admitting him in tenebrae. what's this - "yell "halt" and then walk REALLY SLOWLY to the stranger you stopped. and s w i n g with that halberd as if you've got all the time in the universe" (from the "tenebrae guard instruction book").

other thing i missed were portraits. the game had a very weak story anyway and the npc's didn't have much of a personality, the least thing they could have done was to put some faces on them! the way it was, i mostly remember having very short or very non-interactive conversations with some faceless dummies.

but otherwise i enjoyed most the ability to climb. i only wish there were more areas where it would be useful, for more than climbing over a man-sized obstacle. would have loved to have to climb the mountain, for example. while forced jumping is dumb, i could be glad to have more forced climbing

[countzero]

If you keep pressed the left button on your mouse the avatar takes defense mode
and you can easylly attack him after you take his attack ;]

For the portraits i agree with you i would like to see them..

I also think that ultima 8 had no story at all, you are dropped in pagan
by guardian and you try to go back to britannia, so in order to do that
you need to accomplish a lot of subquests..

I also dislike the fact that you *must* steal if you want to survive
i don't think that the avatar would like to do that.

But the think that still makes me agry is the maps
you don't have map in the whole game so you can easylly lost
and don't know where you should go

lol: you think that we can add a map in the game? (one like ultima 7)

[Grimlock Dragon]

Actually, Ultima 8 had a great background story, and history. It's only the present that was lacking in spacious dialog. Also, I believe the Lost Vale would have had a significant amount of climbing in it. Some people think that the puffy white stuff the Avatar was walking on was snow. I personally think it was clouds. I recall one picture that showed the Avatar as if he was about to jump from one patch of white to another with earth down below the clouds. Also, I think solving the Lost Vale quest would have brought sunlight back to Pagan.

[Colourless]

It's clouds for sure

[Dino3]

>>>I also dislike the fact that you *must* steal if you want to survive

False; I didn't steal and still survived.

>>>I also think that ultima 8 had no story at all, you are dropped in pagan
by guardian and you try to go back to britannia, so in order to do that
you need to accomplish a lot of subquests..

While Ultima 8 had a nice story, it was very short. Imagine how short the game would be without all the jumping and guessing puzzles (especially Hall of the Mountain King).

>>I personally think it was clouds.

I beg to differ - the Avatar is seen walking on that snow. Check the screenshots at http://www.shiftedphase.com/~dino/ultim ... tlvscr.php to see for yourself. It is seen particularly in screenshots 11-13.

>>Also, I think solving the Lost Vale quest would have brought sunlight back to Pagan.

There is nothing to prove this theory, and it seems unlikely to me.

[wjp]

Fixed url: http://www.shiftedphase.com/~dino/ultim ... tlvscr.php

[RazorBlade]

@Dino

I disagree about the snow, I also thought it were clouds. Especially pic 13 implies this, it seems the Avatar jumped from the small cloud to the one on the border; also it is not just a cloud but also some kind of floor. I assume it is a cloud because a) I think it looks like and b) you see a tree under the left one, which would look different if it were snow.

BTW, I read about your ISP, that really sucks. Change it if you can! (I don't really understand why they can ban you though..)

[Dino3]

I don't understand how the Avatar can walk on snow... :p

[Dino3]

Um... I mean clouds, naturally.

"I don't understand how the Avatar can walk on coulds."

[Armchair_Avatar]

I don't understand how the Avatar can walk on clouds.

Magic.

[RazorBlade]

How can rocks fly? They can in Pagan.

[sjs191]

I came across the lost vale images for the first time the other day, and it seemed to me that the white patches were clouds.

Screen 1: The snow/clouds is all at one 'altitude'. If it's snow, why is there none actually on the ground that the avatar is walking on? My impression was that this image represented a high mountain (i.e. above the clouds.)

Screens 11 and 12: OK, here we see not only the avatar able to walk on the snow/clouds but it apparently is also able to support pillars, walls, thrones, a skeleton etc. So my guess was that some (probably magical) aspect of the clouds permits them to support objects. With screen 12, it seems strange to me that the 'snow' ends right after the wall.. this makes sense though if the walls are constructed at the edge of the clouds. Also, why does the non-'snow' covered ground surrounded by rockes (in front of the thrones) not look like the ground under the snow?

Screen 13: There's definately the top of a tree and mushroom _under_ the snow/cloud (even though the snow/cloud is once again 'flat' and all at one altitude) and it does look like the avatar has just jumped from one cloud to the other (which would be unnecessary if it was snow.) Also, in the top it looks like the cloud is over some rock formation (and also, maybe, on the right.)

Anyway, just my 2c...