Pentagram: new savegame menu?

[wjp]

(Note: off-topic post.. this is about Pentagram/Ultima 8.)

In Pentagram we are currently still using the fairly limited savegame menu of the original Ultima 8. I increased the number of available slots yesterday, but that's all.

It would be very nice to enhance this further, to be more Exult-style. However, we'd need a new window design for this.

There is a lot of information that could be displayed for a savegame, such as:

* description (which can be rather long)
* (real-world) date/time
* (in-game) date/time
* what Exult calls 'save count' (the number of times you've saved in the current play-through)
* avatar's stats
* avatar's paperdoll image
* mini screenshot (this is not saved yet, but could be added)
* avatar's coordinates (possibly with the map number converted to a name)
* avatar's name

It is possible to make this window high-resolution (640x400) if it is useful. This would limit its use to scaled games, but I'm guessing not many people run in the unscaled 320x200 resolution.

Does anyone have any good ideas (or even mock-ups) for how this could look?


One possible (320x200) approach would be to keep the book format, display a list of savegames (with abbreviated descriptions) on the left page, and a detailed view (including load/save button, full description, mini screenshot, maybe a paperdoll, real-world date/time and avatar location?) of the currently selected entry on the right page. The current curled page corner buttons for scrolling could remain.

[GuJiaXian]

I like this idea--a lot.

[Gruck]

What is truly sad, is until yesterday when you mentioned it, I had never known there was 12 savegame slots. I had always thought there was only 6, never realizing there was the option to turn the page by selecting the page corners. It's amazing what you can learn 15 years after the fact. If i had known that, I might have been less annoyed by the lack of save spots.

I think it would be best to stick to a 320x200 approach, since as we've discussed today, there are some bugs present in higher resolutions. I don't think there is any need of making things too fancy. I just threw together a very quick MSpaint mockup of what might work.

http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/u5laz ... mockup.png

[wjp]

There are two different resolutions that are important. The game resolution and the actual on-screen resolution. By default, the game will run at 320x200, and this is scaled up to 640x400. The higher resolution bugs you mention show up if the game resolution is higher than 320x200.

However, Pentagram supports displaying windows that are not scaled, so it would be possible to display a 640x400 savegame menu in a 320x200-scaled-up-to-640x400 game. To see an example of this, try loading from an empty savegame slot. The error window you get is high res. [Edit: It might be possible to display the mini-screenshot in high resolution if available while keeping the rest of the menu in 320x200. We use a similar trick for high resolution fonts.]

I like your mockup. It shows quite a bit will fit in 320x200 if laid out properly.

[wjp]

One small addendum: the current savegame descriptions can get quite long. If there's no room to show/enter the full description, that might be a problem.

[Sergorn]

I licku Gruck's mockup so it sounds like a good idea.

In any case I feel it's important to keep the Book GUI look so that it feels consistent with the rest of the game - much like the new options of the Exults menus kept the same look as the original game's menu.

-Sergorn

[Gruck/Dungy]

I really don't know how I ended up using two usernames all the time, it's rather ridiculous...

WJP, I never realized the original savegames allowed 4 lines. That to me seems longer than is truly necessary. I don't think I've ever felt the need to write a description more than 1 or 2 lines long. I suppose if one really needed to write things like, "I need to return the forcefield ring to the Sorcerors immediately for Devon's birthday." (Which just barely fits), then all 4 lines would be necessary, but that seems slightly overzealous to me. Even at 4-lines length, you could probably fit 4 savegames per screen on the scrollbar if you got rid of those horrible giant "Entry 1, Entry 2, Entry 3, etc."

Maybe limit it to 2 or 3 lines. That seems like more than enough to me.
2 lines still allows savegames like, "Return to Vardion for surprise birthday cake!"

[Dominus]

I like the mockup and I also agree on the length of the description

[BansheeX]

Seems overkill to me. Is it really that hard to differentiate main progress from a few backups with descriptions alone?

Something I would like to see is for pentagram to externalize the game's script/audio/gfx data to allow for drop-in replaceable mods. I'd like to try my hand at arranging the soundtrack with something better than general midi instruments.

I'd also like to see native directx/xaudio2 driver options for Windows 7 users, and corresponding vsync ability for smooth video. Even an emulator like bsnes can do this.

[Dominus]

Seems overkill to me. Is it really that hard to differentiate main progress from a few backups with descriptions alone?

It is not needed but a nice addition. In Exult it proved to be a good one.

Something I would like to see is for pentagram to externalize the game's script/audio/gfx data to allow for drop-in replaceable mods.

For that you will probably need someone with the needed skills for modding Pentagram in this way. The developers themselves don't seem to want to got the Exult Studio way with Pentagram.

I'd also like to see native directx/xaudio2 driver options for Windows 7 users

what does that do or add?

corresponding vsync ability for smooth video

I don't think vsync will add smooth video, it's probably more complicated thatn that...

Even an emulator like bsnes can do this.

Not a good way to make someone do something

[BansheeX]

I only mention it because it's open source and that might help someone looking to find well written windows drivers for a game. I don't know how specific the driver code is to the program, but I imagine it would be useful as an example to draw upon.

Never seen tearing in a video game? That's what vsync solves. I dunno, imagine good windows drivers would perform better and be more future proof than SDL.

[Dominus]

I don't see much chance of us ever abandoning SDL in favor of Windows only drivers...

[wjp]

SDL 1.3 is rumoured to be much better in this respect. You're welcome to submit a patch moving Pentagram to the new SDL 1.3 interface in preparation for its release and to test it.